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Scale Helicopters Discuss scale helicopters, tips, tricks and scale construction threads |
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11-27-2014, 03:49 PM | #1 |
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Scale helicopter manoeuvres
The MAAC R/C Scale documents are written for airplanes and have five levels of scale competition; Fun, Sport, Standoff, Team, and Expert.
The MAAC R/C Helicopter Rules specify several competition categories for pod and boom helicopters, but there is only a single category for scale and three manoeuvres to be flown. Scale Over Ottawa The first Scale Over Ottawa event was held in 2013. This event is open to all scale AIRCRAFT, so I decided to participate in 2014 with my helicopter. The competition had Fun and Sport scale categories administered in accordance with the MAAC rules. The flight routines for both categories are the same; only the static scale judging differs. The mandatory flight manoeuvres and some of the optional manoeuvres for airplanes can be flown just as well by helicopters, but a few changes and additions were necessary to reflect the unique operational characteristics of helicopters. After reviewing a variety of helicopter training manuals from the full scale world, I prepared the attached document and it was used for judging my flights during the 2014 Scale Over Ottawa event. So with that explained, I'm open to your ideas to improve the scale helicopter manoeuvres and encourage more scale competition with an emphasis on scale flying presentation. The next Scale over Ottawa event is tentatively scheduled for July 18 & 19, 2015. Last year's event was well attended and I'm hoping the next one will have increased participation by scale helicopter enthusiasts. Right Pierre? G |
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11-28-2014, 09:38 AM | #3 |
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Re: Scale helicopter manoeuvres
Normal hover for a full size heli is less that one rotor diameter. it sits on top of the down wash bubble. The hover you call for is a high hover and used when winching someone out of the bush. The pilots spend a lot of time perfecting autorotation. If you loose the tail rotor on a Huey the vertical fin allows them to do a slide on landing at 60 MPH. Auto rotation with forward speed seemed to be the trickiest. I seen one pilot bend the landing gear so bad the bottom of the fuselage hit the ground. The main rotor was bent up in 1/3rd of a circle. I was sitting in the right seat when he did this. He passed an open field just above the trees at 80 MPH and at the far end did a stall turn to the left which brought him to the center line of the field. He then proceeded to put it down in the middle of the field. He then announced that normally the troops would have 20 seconds to clear the chopper and he took off. The whole maneouver took about fourty seconds. This is incase the LZ is hot. Maybe you could add some of these to your list.
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11-28-2014, 09:43 AM | #4 |
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Re: Scale helicopter manoeuvres
Hi Joe;
An approach slope is not specified therefore the pilot can fly his preference. My reasoning is that a helicopter flight should not be judged differently in a combined fixed/rotary wing scale competition. The scale airplane manoeuvres don't include a deadstick landing and the scale helicopter rules don't list an auto. To be consistent I didn't include the auto option in a combined scale competition. An auto could be added as a landing option for a scale helicopter only competition with additional points for difficulty. I don't know if pilots would risk their machines. However, a practice auto with power recovery would certainly be a low risk option. Thanks for the idea! G |
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11-28-2014, 10:44 AM | #5 |
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Re: Scale helicopter manoeuvres
This past summer, I attended IRCHA for the scale flying event. I got a crash course in setting up a flight plan and how to make it all work as one unit. Darrell Sprayberry, who is the CD for that and the US Nationals, posted a PDF file of the maneuvers that he and many other scale pilots use to plan their flights from take-off to landing. The contest is broken down into to distinct parts, Mandatory Maneuvers and Freestyle Flight.
The Mandatory section is fairly simple and all MUST do it in the order it is set out. It starts out tail in and the first part is the take-off to a hover at 6', followed by a 90 degree clearing turn to the right or left, and then an opposite 180 degree turn to the left or right. That is then followed by a 45 degree climb-out to 20 feet. The last part is a landing approach from 20 feet in altitude at a 45 degree angle to the takeoff circle with minimal hover just before touchdown. From there, you can begin the Freestyle flight which should be no more than 5 minutes. it will include takeoffs and landings of your choice (lots of different ways) and does include an autorotation landing option. Very few pilots will take the chance of the auto as it is always a very high risk landing with most giving it the name of a controlled crash landing within sight. I have only one helicopter that I have truly practised autorotation landings with and so far, the landing gear has taken a hit. Our flight altitudes for scale flying are not the same as open 3D or AMA so right off the bat, we disadvantage ourselves for a smooth flight for the judges to look at if we suddenly jump way up in the air for an auto. The other two divisions start way up in the air and therefore the pilot has lots of altitude to get the helicopter into a smooth transition from forward flight to autorotation approach. It can be on average 100 to 500 feet above ground. Most of our flying is done at less than 75 feet and in a much more confined area compared to FAI. There are many that do autos for fun but few tempt fate at the competition level. Our biggest issue is the much lower rotor speeds we start at compared to other helicopters that regularly do autos. I can't post the original zipped file here but I did find the link, whew. There is a blank sheet in the zip so that if you have something that is not covered, you can put it in with a drawing of what it is supposed to look like. I'll give you an example. The zip has a file in there called the Lazy 8. The flight description is a horizontal figure 8 flown with an open crossing in the middle, unlike the Figure 8 where the flight is proper circles flown and joined in the middle. When you go to full sized aircraft, the Lazy 8 is nothing like either one so if I was to include that, I would make a sheet up on a blank form, call it what every I want (to avoid confusion with the listed maneuvers) and present that to the judges. I know that this coming summer, I will not be able to attend the Ottawa event as I am already books for the third and fourth weekends of July, sigh. Hope this helps things out. Don http://www.helitronix.com/maneuvers/info.zip Last edited by Keyrigger; 11-28-2014 at 02:02 PM. |
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11-28-2014, 11:24 AM | #6 |
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Re: Scale helicopter manoeuvres
I think all of the MAAC contest regulations for helis - pod and boom and scale are LONG overdue for a rewrite, since the current ones were written way back in the mid 90's!
I had tried many times, during the many years that I was the chair of the MAAC helicopter committee, to stimulate an interest in helicopter competitions. All to no avail, as the Canadian heli flyers did not seem very keen on such competitions. The last heli Nats were 14 years ago here in Vancouver. In the past decade, I have found interest growing in the scale community. Consequently, I am very happy to see this thread on the scale forum. Thank you for starting this thread Peter. As most scale (and pod and boom) competitors that I know of like to compete in such competitions in the USA, and considering the fact that they have far more then we do. I think it may be a good idea to adopt as much of their rules as we can. This would make it very easy for us to be ready to compete there and encourage their scale fliers to come up here and compete. I had reviewed Darrel Sprayberry's rules when they were posted on some of the US scale heli forums and found them to be well thought out. The group of their scale fliers who helped make them up are all very long time, and well experienced members of the US scale scene, even with some input from the Brits. I like the "freestyle" section because it allows the contestant to be creative with coming up with different maneuvers that would be typical for his particular model. This would also make it more interesting for the judges and the spectators. As for a more difficult maneuver like the auto, I think it should have a K factor applied.
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11-28-2014, 12:04 PM | #7 |
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Re: Scale helicopter manoeuvres
Hi Phil:
Darrell and I talked about the factoring of the maneuvers. While there is an emphasis on flying, it is entirely possible for a Freestyle flight to consist mostly of hovering maneuvers. They tend to be overall much easier to do than something like a Missed Approach. If the winds are favourable (in Muncie, 20km winds are the average for any given day), you could have perfect hovering done and get top marks for those but is that as difficult as the Bump, Loop, Figure 8, or Autorotation Landing? We both think not. Some method of sorting out of the list is going to be done by as many pilots as can give input. The goal is to have a balanced approach to the Freestyle so that a very good rendition of a very difficult move will not be eclipsed by a very good simple one. I saw my first AMA competition where all pilots are given the same flight plan and are required to execute it exactly the same. There, everyone has the same basic setup for the helicopter and the skill level to be at those competitions is very high but not unapproachable. In scale, no two helicopters are the same (unless built from the same manufacturer) and even then, there are subtle differences that might prevent one from doing a loop while the other laughs it off. This is where the idea of factoring came in but it was more so that the judges understand that a pedal turn at 6 ft. is a lot harder to do than a simple tail-in hover. Likewise, a Nose-in hover is much harder than a Tail-in hover. I'm going to talk with Darrell over the next couple of months to find out exactly what feedback he is looking to get and will keep everyone up to date as I can. I am looking forward to going to the US Nationals for the first time next year and returning to IRCHA to see if I can repeat or better my placing there. It will be my new CH-139 that will take the stage next year as the TOW Defender will not cut the cake for documentation. THAT is whole different animal to talk about. Hope the helps. Take care. Don Last edited by Keyrigger; 11-28-2014 at 01:50 PM. |
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11-28-2014, 12:59 PM | #8 |
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Re: Scale helicopter manoeuvres
I know this is barely a small break from my last post but I did phone Darrell and got a bit of clarification done. AMA for many years used "K" factoring to divide up the difficulty of the flight. For many years it appeared to work but in the long run, it failed. What they do now is to pre-determine the flight and all fly the same (mentioned before) so that everyone has the same potential score. They also do two or three different flight plans over the course of the competition so as not to play favourites. Also, the actual flight plan is plucked out of a hat by the pilots so that no one will be able to cherry pick the plan.
Since "K" factoring ultimately failed there, he felt that there was no need to try and re-invent it. A few years ago, there was a trend to do only hovering moves by many competitors and although entirely possible, there was no art to it at all. They have gone now with the two-part flight and the Mandatories are the same for all. It is a tail-in liftoff to a hover and holding it for ten seconds. Then the next part is a turn to the right and hold and finally a turn to the left and hold (or vice-versa depending on the wind or competitor choosing) for another ten seconds total. From there, there is a climb-out on a 45 degree angle to a height of 7 meters (24'). From there, the pilot can either reverse and start his landing approach (Translational Landing) or fly to the opposite side and begin the landing. There are three judges for the event. One is given the specific task of looking at the entire flight and giving it a score based on artistic impression (no comparisons to skating, please). The other two concentrate more on how well the maneuver is done and between the three, a score is arrived at. During the Mandatories, all three judge the maneuvers based on how well it was done compared to what it is supposed to look like. Darrell informed me that he will get a video put together of the Mandatory Maneuvers so that people can see how it is supposed to be done perfectly and also the same routine done not so perfectly and how much the mistake would cost the pilot in competition. We also touched on how a full size Apache can do most anything like loops, rolls, and pirouettes while a Jet Ranger would look absolutely wrong doing loops and rolls. In full size, a Ranger MUST not ever loop or roll. This is where artistic impression will come in so that an Apache (while capable of loops) will not just walk over another helicopter that cannot do so in real life. There is lots of time to get things settled as to how it can be done and if anyone needs to talk to him about setting up a competition, he will be more than happy to spend some time with you on the subject. Take care. Don Last edited by Keyrigger; 11-28-2014 at 01:49 PM. |
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11-28-2014, 05:26 PM | #9 |
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Re: Scale helicopter manoeuvres
There are a number of issues to consider when drafting scale heli contest rules compared to Precision aerobatics heli rules (e.g. FAI/F3C or AMA class 1, 2 or 3) or 3D (XHC, 3D masters or FAI/F3N), as what we may be trying to accomplish is different, though in all cases we are trying to show different skills and have them judged accordingly.
In scale competitions, there are three skills or categories we are trying to show. 1 - the various skills of the contestant who built the model and in detailing his/her model so that it replicate the full scale example as accurately as possible. 2 - the skill of the contestant, in how well he can fly the model while making it replicate as much of the flight envelope of the full scale version as possible, in a scale like manner. 3 - the skill of the contestant in replicating special mechanical options he may have built into his model - retracts, winching systems, lighting systems, weapons systems etc. Here these are part and parcel to be considered in both #1 and #2. In summary, when drafting such contest rules, we should always consider the importance of the term "replicate" as it applies in all three considerations.
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11-28-2014, 06:39 PM | #10 |
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Re: Scale helicopter manoeuvres
As an aside to maneuverability, my CH-139 has been looped many times just for fun and it can be put through Immelmans, Split "S"s, and inverted hovering but we won't go there, lol. I have not done a roll but if it can do the above, a roll is well within its capabilities as I did them with it when it was just a pod and boom 550. Take care.
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