[Wayne MIller]

Hi,

I'll try and answer some of the concerns. First, my suggestion of being able to track the participation in each segment of the hobby, was simply to identify, and then to better serve the modellers in each segment of MAAC. The intent was not to change the wings program. Although standardizing the wings program may be needed in the future to satisfy the insurance companies - but that is another topic.

I too am an older modeller and I must admit I am resistant to change (but don't tell anybody!), especially when I think it is unnecessary. I have seen a lot of change in my life, and have also be resistance to many of these changes. However, if I step back and analyze a suggested proposed change, many times I will accept the change simply because I see they are necessary in order to progress, then later I learn to embrace them simply because they usually make less work for me and give me more information after the initial learning curve. An example is computers, which most of you now take for granted. Just look at the changes in our modelling equipment and also the ordering of modelling supplies online. Some accepted these changes and some didn't. ATM's etc.

I must admit, I still don't like some changes, such as trying to get to someone in an office, or an answer to a question when using an automated phone system - it drives me nuts.

My concern was, and still is, MAAC's future. I think the only way we can plan our future, and progress logically is by being able to track how many modellers we have in each segment of the hobby and then we need to build MAAC programs to keep the "strong segments" growing, and also to build programs to build up the "weak segments" of our hobby. We can not do this unless we know the numbers in each segment.

Side benefits of the designations would be many, such as being able to direct new modelers, who contact MAAC, to find an instructor in their area. Things would be done by simple mouse movements instead of trying to it manually - I think it would reduce the office workload, not increase it.

I fully realize that many people do not want to see any changes being made, and I can understand this, but I do hope we don't become a stagnant organization simply because we are an organization reluctant to change.

I hope I clarified my thinking - thanks for letting me bend your ear.

Now go out and -

Fly4Fun,

Wayne Miller

[hydravien]

wayne,
i agree with you 100% on the need for a standardized wings program.
eventually, like you said, insurance companies will be looking for a way to cut back expenses, or to get rid of unsafe things, and one of them would be rc. but having a program that needs to be completed is kind of like driving lessons. while it will be some extra work, it would make the future of rc more secure.

[JimMcIntyre]

I don't have a problem with standardising the wings program, and I don't fear change (or I wouldn't be in the career I chose)...

That said, we must be careful when insituting change that it doesn't cripple the fun or create a liability with our insurance. We must be prepared to walk-the-walk when the talk is done, and that's not easy in a volunteer-based organization...

Further, the hobby is growing into areas we couldn't have foreseen even 5 years ago. We must be cautious we're not an impediment to that growth but, an asset.

I'm all for change, where tha change is a result of addressing the need. Let's be certain we understand the need before we try to address it.

[Wayne MIller]

Hi Jim,

I was putting some thought into this last night. As a result I tried to analyze the reluctance to have the different qualifications of pilots put into place, and how it could be made workable.

I'm guessing the reluctance may be:
1. MAAC would be resistance due to what they would consider extra input.
2. Club Membership Directors and instructors would be reluctant due to what they would consider being extra input at there end.

My thoughts are that this could be a win - win situation if approached properly.

I think most clubs have a membership in the neighbourhood of 25 to 50 members with a very few topping 100.

If MAAC put together a common Excel worksheet that would incorporate the necessary fields, and a mailing list, perhaps list the date dues were paid, and menu driven sorting functions, then distribute this software to each club when they register each year, then this could be a benefit to the club as well as MAAC.

The club would enter all the data at the club level, and since input would be at time of dues being paid, the input would not be a large task. When the club pays MAAC dues each month (or whenever) they would send their copy of the updated spreadsheet to MAAC. This would be incorporated into a "MAAC master monthly spreadsheet" at MAAC through an automated function and would eliminate a lot of work for the MAAC's staff.

The benefit to the club is there would be software to keep track of their membership, the membership interests, dues paid, different pilot qualifications and print data such as dues paid, mailing labels for their mailings and newsletters.

MAAC's benefit would be to have all current data at their fingertips with minimal input.

Of course, MAAC would have to have their firewalls and virus protection up to date at all times, but I'm hoping this is done anyways.

I need feedback on this - do you think it would be workable?

Thanks, any thoughts would be appreciated.

Fly4Fun,

Wayne Miller

[Canhos]

Wayne

While your idea is good, it won't be 100%. Without making it a requirement, I doubt every club will comply. Even then, who can gaurantee that the info will be updated throughout the year. The other issue is multiple memberships.

I fly at an electric only field, in another communittee ( EP sometimes S)
My "home" field I also fly ( EPFS G soon, and heli)
I'm going to be looking for a third, as my home field is sometimes closed, and I prefer the IC engines. (I'd probably need to have a PFS designation at this one.

Now, with just this one case, the numbers get screwed up. They can sort it out by the MAAC number, but it's more work. Then there is the question. What does Mike really fly?

What do you do if someone moves?

Both of these senarios puts more work at the office. And it will be something that always requires updating.

Maybe your spreadsheet could amalgimate the multiple entries into one.

Just thought of another issue. Due to privacy laws, MAAC can't distribute this list. It won't do anything for the clubs. All it will do is provide a survey to gauge interest.

We'd need to have the data on our MAAC cards, but then, it won't be current...... Perhaps this would cause the membership to put pressure on at the club level to get it done every year.

I'm gonna leave before I sit here and brainstorm all day.

[JimMcIntyre]

Originally Posted by JimMcIntyre

Let's be certain we understand the need before we try to address it.

You're getting into solutions already, all the warning signs are here for me including the attempt to use a spreadsheet for data gathering....

As I said, let's be sure of the problem we're trying to address, determine the requirements and then we can talk solution. I'm willing to contribute to design of any system (this is my area of expertise) but, let's not get ahead of ourselves or our efforts will be wasted.

If all you want is a survey, that's fine and MAAC has done this before, we should learn from this past experience.

If, you want to standardise a pilot qualification program acceptable to all MAAC chartered clubs, I suggest you put together a proposal and shop it through the established venue (through the zone meetings) to get buy-in or it simply won't happen...

[Guest]

Wayne what you are suggesting may or may not be workable and the best way to find out is for you to take the bull by the horns and get involved. You could make it easy for them and put together exactly what you think would work including the layout of the spread sheet etc. Better yet get yourself involved in one of the appropriate committees and get it passed through the committee members then send it on as a recommendation to the board at the AGM. At the least if you came up with a workable recommendation and had it approved at your AZM it would at least be on the table for discussion at the AGM. In the past at work and in other organizations lots of good ideas are suggested. Many of these fall by the wayside simply because no one is willing to work out the details.

Comittees you might approach or join.
http://www.maac.ca/committees/maac_committee.php?cm=15
http://www.maac.ca/committees/maac_committee.php?cm=18
http://www.maac.ca/committees/maac_committee.php?cm=6

Dennis

[JimMcIntyre]

Originally Posted by Propworn

... including the layout of the spread sheet etc....

Please ... if you listen to one thing I'm writing, do not attempt to do anything of this scale with a simple spreadhseet. This is a common, well known failed project anti-pattern in my industry. Spreadsheets are not databases, nor are they a good tool for data-gathering. Prototyping ... well ok, data analysis yes (for small models), forecasting and what-if scenarios, perfect but, they were not designed and do not scale well as a multi-user application, especially when used for data gathering. Just think, how many clubs are there? Have you ever tried to merge that many spreadsheets... I know many who've tried.

I agree with Dennis, it's a good idea to start with the committees he's listed, there is a lot of experience collected there and this is the proper venue to begin, perhaps what you're envisioning has been tried and you can learn fomr that.... Take the time to think through your goal and visit all potential ways of achieving it. By all means let's discuss it but let's not jump to solutions until we fully understand the problems we're addressing. If/when the time comes that you're looking for some way of automating your solution, I'm there.

[tech1]

If MAAC wants to know what I fly all they need to do is ask. I would be happy to supply this information when I renew my membership every year.

Do we really need the in-depth day to day policing of the data, or just a census?

I would agree don't make this complicated if it does not need to be.

[j-coles]

i think i would hesitate designating differant types of pilots partly because it would give birth to the common complaint or comparison between differant types of pilots

at this point ALL pilots are equal in a sence BUT with designations,,??

although I like the idea
personally i think ONE thing should happen however new pilots or beginners should wear some thing or have some form of marker to at least warn others to take heed or in other words ;;keep clear and allow the pilot extra room etc

j-coles