Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed - Page 11 - RCCanada - Canada Radio Controlled Hobby Forum
RCCanada - Canada's Radio Control Hobby Forum
General RC Aircraft Discussion Discuss anything RC related

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-21-2021, 01:47 PM   #101
jtsmash
RCC Contributor
 
I am: Jason T.
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Sudbury, Ontario
Radio of choice:
DX9 /Tactic ttx650
# of RCs: 9

Feedback: 10 / 92%
Posts: 439
Total Props: 6
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed


       Remove this ad - become a site supporter!
Quote:
Originally Posted by RSVenture View Post
Just got my latest Model Aviation Canada magazine today. Good article on pages 38 to 40 regarding Millenium generation. Quite an interesting perspective.
That was a very good insight into what small changes could be made at the club(s) to keep the younger crowd interested. Great article. Will have to give some of those ideas a try.
__________________
www.smac.vianet.ca
Instructor
MAAC 40891
IMAC 8158
jtsmash is offline   Quick reply to this message.

Sponsored Links - Subscribe to remove this ad.
Old 07-21-2021, 02:25 PM   #102
4*60
RCC Supreme Contributor
 
4*60's Avatar
 
I am: DSM
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Shuswap/Blind Bay
Radio of choice:
Taranis
# of RCs: 14

Feedback: 14 / 100%
Posts: 2,850
Total Props: 25
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

Re:Millenial article. I've witnessed some of this. Near Hemet California a millenial wanted to know what it would be like if the suggested speeds around the curves on a mountain highway were driven doublethe posted. He found out when he crossed over the double line and hit an older couples vehicle and nearly killed them. I was right behind and saw it all. His only comment was a plea"GET ME OUT OF HERE!!" as he was trapped in his vehicle. I and others ignored him and looked after the couple.
Can you also imagine training someone for a pilots licence and before they are ready and with no discussion they "try a loop". After the wings come off from exceeding the G forces designed perhaps they would have time to apologize to the instructor on the way down. I say this because we have had this scenario with model flying.
I find this "random" undisciplined approach in software these days and now I understand why I am sometimes perplexed by the lack of logic in some of it these days.

But they are taught that way, to explore on their own and investigate and whether stuff works or not or ends in disaster they tried so get an "A+"

I'm just an older linear codger who does things in a logical order and when I do things they stay standing or they operate correctly and don't kill someone.
4*60 is offline   Quick reply to this message.
Old 07-21-2021, 03:13 PM   #103
stegl
RCC Supreme Contributor
 
I am: Len S
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Kelowna
Radio of choice:
DS16 And still use my trusty SD-10.
# of RCs: 10

Feedback: 198 / 100%
Posts: 8,086
Total Props: 59
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtsmash View Post
That was a very good insight into what small changes could be made at the club(s) to keep the younger crowd interested. Great article. Will have to give some of those ideas a try.
Not sure what ages the younger crowd are but as they grow older , have families or tied to a demanding career , time and money becomes scare and they may not be back until in their 50-60s or when the kids are moved out and on their own.
stegl is online now   Quick reply to this message.
 
Old 07-21-2021, 04:49 PM   #104
Morison
RCC Expert Contributor
 
I am: Keith Morison
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Calgary AB

Feedback: 2 / 100%
Posts: 776
Total Props: 23
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

Quote:
Originally Posted by stegl View Post
Not sure what ages the younger crowd are but as they grow older , have families or tied to a demanding career , time and money becomes scare and they may not be back until in their 50-60s or when the kids are moved out and on their own.
Millennials are between 21 and 39 years old now... so the top-end are very much a good investment for MAAC. The author of the story would be early '40s, just coming back into the hobby after ~5 years away.

I think you'll find that this generation also looks at their time commitments differently.
__________________
Keith Morison
MAAC 24909L
VA6 PIX
Morison Communications - Publishers of Model Aviation Canada
Morison is offline   Quick reply to this message.
Old 07-21-2021, 06:16 PM   #105
OLD PRAIRIE RED NECK
RCC Supreme Contributor
 
OLD PRAIRIE RED NECK's Avatar
 
I am: MERVIN BURKINSHAW
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CORONATION ALBERTA
Radio of choice:
HITEC
# of RCs: 13

Feedback: 11 / 100%
Posts: 4,992
Total Props: 80
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

Somewhere between the "Bend the rules to fit what I want" generation and the "Trued and proven to work" generation we may find a compromise. I like the idea of a designated time period or day where these "Try is my way" fellows can have at it in peace. The only concern then is the neighbors... but if there is a size restriction... say 250 grams...
__________________
I never finish anything, I have a black belt in the partial arts!
OLD PRAIRIE RED NECK is offline   Quick reply to this message.
Old 07-21-2021, 08:04 PM   #106
reo
RCC Supreme Contributor
 
I am: Ron O.
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Millet, AB

Feedback: 93 / 100%
Posts: 3,377
Total Props: 49
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

I was at a well attended funfly this last weekend and judging by what was on the very busy flightline I would say that the AS3X crowd was well represented and that topic didn't even come up in discussion, go figure.....wait, maybe everyone was too busy flying to waste time talking about it.
__________________
Ponoka RC Flyers
reo is offline   Quick reply to this message.
Old 07-21-2021, 09:18 PM   #107
RSVenture
Level 3 Supporter
★ Site Supporter ★
 
RSVenture's Avatar
 
I am: Arnold H
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Hartney, Manitoba
Radio of choice:
Frsky Horus X10s
# of RCs: 14

Feedback: 57 / 100%
Posts: 480
Total Props: 2
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

Great to hear REO. Hope you had a great weekend.
__________________
MAAC #42080
RSVenture is offline   Quick reply to this message.
Old 07-22-2021, 03:04 PM   #108
OLD PRAIRIE RED NECK
RCC Supreme Contributor
 
OLD PRAIRIE RED NECK's Avatar
 
I am: MERVIN BURKINSHAW
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: CORONATION ALBERTA
Radio of choice:
HITEC
# of RCs: 13

Feedback: 11 / 100%
Posts: 4,992
Total Props: 80
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

Tell us how many guys were flying with SAFE Ron.
__________________
I never finish anything, I have a black belt in the partial arts!
OLD PRAIRIE RED NECK is offline   Quick reply to this message.
Old 07-22-2021, 03:41 PM   #109
Hepdog
RCC Apprentice
 
I am: Randy
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Stonewall, Manitoba
Radio of choice:
Futaba
# of RCs: 20+

Feedback: 0 / 0%
Posts: 79
Total Props: 3
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

After reading all these very well researched and supported arguments I think I understand now and have compiled a proposed set of new rules for all training and especially testing. All flight training and testing must be done as follows:

1 – no on-board electronic aids whatsoever. Digital servos are also prohibited because they center too accurately, and real pilots must contend with constant trim issues.

2 - computer radios are allowed provided no electronic gizmos are used. This includes no use of exponential, no mixing of rudder and ailerons, and no electronic aileron differential or similar (all prohibited as its just a crutch - real pilots don't use that).

2b- No electronic servo reversing, or end point adjustments allowed. Mechanical control throws must also be set at the structural maximum deflection and sensitivity to ensure the student can handle a "real airplane".

3 – must use an aircraft weighing at least 6 pounds with a high wing loading to ensure stalls are full and pronounced because that is what real pilots fly. The use of any leading-edge stall delay device/additions is prohibited, unless used on one wing only to ensure a sufficiently nasty full snap roll on stalling – because real pilots must deal with that. Warped wings are permitted and encouraged.

4 – the training aircraft must be a uniform colour, preferably white or grey, with no markings to distinguish top from bottom or left from right, because that’s what real scale pilots fly. Anything else is a crutch.

5 – must use a low wing aircraft having no more than 1 degree of dihedral and tail moments no longer than 1/4 wingspan to ensure no artificial stabilization effects. Motors must be installed at Zero-Zero to ensure constant attitude changes with power because that's how real pilots fly.

6 – must use a tail dragger with a fixed tailwheel aircraft because real pilots must be conversant on real hard to take off/land aircraft.

7 - must use glow powered aircraft only, without onboard glow drivers because real pilots must be able to handle dead sticks at any time. Electric and gas are prohibited because they are too reliable. Electric starters are also prohibited, the student must start the motor using a gloved or preferably bare hand. Chicken sticks are for, well chickens. Band-aids, if required must be Kleene-ex and electrical tape.

8 - must use balsa stick-built aircraft. Balsa ARF is tolerated but plans built is preferred because real pilots need to understand how the aircraft is built from scratch. Foam aircraft of any type are prohibited and deemed cheap junk – especially if from overseas. Multirotors are strictly prohibited because they are new and scary looking.

9 - all training and testing must occur on very windy, gusty, overcast grey sky days because real pilots must fly in all weather conditions - especially where visibility and silhouetting is an issue, or beyond the ability of the airplane. Calm wind blue sky flying is always prohibited during training.

8 - all training and testing must always occur with the maximum number of aircraft in the pattern. One club member must "break" pattern rules and intentionally conflict with the student aircraft on each flight because real pilots must deal with this all the time. No spotter assistance is allowed for the student pilot because that too is a crutch – real pilots don’t need that help.

9 - at least once during training and again on the test flight, another club member must tune a 60-size glow engine, at full throttle, for the duration of the flight, no more than 10 meters directly behind the student because real pilots must be able to handle distractions.

10- Half of the test flight and landing must occur using rudder and throttle only because real pilots must be able to handle servo failures, and fly the plane using minimal controls.

11 – during the test flight the examiner must attempt to knock the transmitter out of the students’ hands or attempt to push the student over because that could happen at any time, and they must demonstrate an ability to recover – like real pilots do.

12 - After passing the initial test, the student is probationary and only allowed to fly the exact type of test flight aircraft solo. ANY new type of aircraft must follow all of the above rules because flying models is really hard and we wouldn't want to allow just anyone into our elite group.

13 - The student will continue to be probationary until a later totally random point in time when the established Club members deems them worthy of being a part of the elite fraternity. This will normally occur once they have demonstrated competency on scale gas Warbirds or other "real" model aircraft – or 10 years Club membership which ever comes first.

14 - after acceptance, the new pilot will need to continuously prove themselves worthy to the established Club members, especially the elder Club members who can no longer fly themselves but can (and will) provide unsolicited mandatory “sage advice” from the benches.

15 – none of the above applies to the established Club elders, regardless of the number of times they lose control and fly over the pits, spectators or crash off field or similar. Club elders and established members can do and fly as they please and will not be challenged by younger newer members.

Or we could just accept this is a hobby with many ways to have some fun – inside the actual required rules. BTW none of the above was serious…..some might totally agree – scary!

Last edited by Hepdog; 07-22-2021 at 05:26 PM. Reason: added 2 b...
Hepdog is offline   Quick reply to this message.
Old 07-22-2021, 03:53 PM   #110
reo
RCC Supreme Contributor
 
I am: Ron O.
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Millet, AB

Feedback: 93 / 100%
Posts: 3,377
Total Props: 49
Re: Training new pilots and planes with SAFE and flight stabilization installed

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD PRAIRIE RED NECK View Post
Tell us how many guys were flying with SAFE Ron.
Apparently no one there felt it was an issue, lots of flying and a safe weekend over all, isn't that what our hobby is all about?
__________________
Ponoka RC Flyers
reo is offline   Quick reply to this message.
Closed Thread

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the RCCanada - Canada Radio Controlled Hobby Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

Member names may only be composed of alpha-numeric characters. (A-Z and 0-9)

!!ATTENTION ADVERTISERS!! If you intend on advertising anything on this forum, whatsoever, you are required to first contact us here . Additionally, we do NOT allow BUSINESS NAMES unless you are an Authorized Vendor. If you own a business, and want to do sales on this site via posting or private message, you will need to follow the rules. Shops, Stores, Distributors, Group Buys without being authorized will see your account terminated.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:
Radio of choice?
Which radio is your current favorite to use?
Number of RC Vehicles?
How many boats, cars, planes do you own?

Log-in



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
vBulletin Message

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:54 PM.


vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.