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Old 12-16-2008, 09:30 PM   #1
bob forest
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Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ


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For those that are not sure of what is going on. Here is a good explanation.
It was written and proof read by Isabel Deslauriers,Scot Harrison and Dave Rees.

Is RC modeling doomed in the Province of Quebec?
The Brossair club has been peacefully tucked away on a farmland for over 25 years. Yet, over the last couple of years, it has been forced to spend around 12,000$ (including member donations, and support from MAAC) to defend itself against the CPTAQ, an agency of the Government of Quebec. Several clubs have faced this agency and few have escaped unscathed. Last year, Club Lafayette de Marieville was ordered to close down. Brossair, second in line, lost in court and is awaiting a decision from the appeals tribunal. Club Modéliste Montérégie is facing the judge in a few weeks, but has no funds to fight. Modelers across the province are crossing their fingers, hoping their field is not the next one.
The law in question has for object to forbid any non-agricultural activity on agricultural land in the province of Quebec, theoretically in order to protect significant farmland encroachment. However, a historical review of past cases shows the extent of the power exerted by the CPTAQ, who has gone as far as shutting down a mom’s daycare in a farmhouse basement, based on this law. There is, however, one way to escape – the CPTAQ has the power to grant exceptions to whomever they like. Members of the clubs affected by the crackdown often reflect that they are positive influences on the community, occupy a minuscule footprint of land, and get along well with the landowners. Nearby clubs have full membership rosters. Surrounding land is zoned agricultural or residential for hundreds of miles. But these things seem to mean nothing – lacking the strong political influence of land developers, they are relying on grass-root efforts to obtain the exception they require to continue their hobby. If the government cannot be swayed, many modelers will have no place to fly when summer comes this year.

Please attach your name to the letter below, and forward to:
Nathalie Normandeau: [email protected]
Michelle Courchesne: [email protected].
Marguerite Blais: [email protected].
Tony Tomassi: [email protected]

Then, please cut and paste this letter in the messages section, after ticking the appropriate categories and filling in details:
https://www.premier.gouv.qc.ca/premi...mulaire-en.asp

Thank you for your help; we all know how tough it can be to find a club site, and how carefully we must guard them!!!

Attn: Jean Charest, Nathalie Normandeau, Michelle Courchesne, Marguerite Blais, Tony Tomassi

Like many others, I am writing you because I am distressed by the actions of the CPTAQ against radio control flying clubs using agricultural land. I, like all other modellers, would like to see reason and common sense applied to this law which is forcing modellers to cease their operations on agricultural lands.



In fact, model airplane clubs use very little land. Most clubs use less than an acre, but due to the nature of the sport require a surrounding area free of development to act in a safe and controlled manner. Members are proud of their clubs and do their utmost to maintain an open and inviting atmosphere for all who come to enjoy the action. Landowners are happy to have modellers as tenants on their land, with many clubs occupying the same site for decades. This is often due to club members maintaining and keeping the property secure, at no expense to the land owner. The land occupied by model airplane clubs is not land that the owner is using for agriculture, typically an area not suitable for farming. If it were land that the farmer wanted to reclaim for agricultural use, then I wouldn’t be writing to you now; this land can revert to cultivation at any time if the need arises. Permanent structures are not crucial for model airplane clubs.

The hobby brings joy to many people. The people who fly these models enjoy many aspects of the hobby. The skills and knowledge developed and learned can be parlayed into many other areas of both personal and professional life. There are many skills sets involved in model aviation in addition to the skills required to successfully fly these models, skills are developed through the building and maintaining of models. These skills include woodworking, electronics, basic physics etc. Many modellers have been inspired by their passion for modeling, and have gone on to successful careers in aviation. As I’m sure you are aware, the aviation industry thrives in Quebec. It would be a shame to lose this potential source of inspiration for our smartest young people.



Simply allowing radio control flying clubs to operate on small portions of agricultural land in Quebec will benefit your economy. Many modellers travel vast distances over the summer to attend an array of club events in Quebec bringing model airplane enthusiasts from all over North America. Obviously, hobby shops will be adversely affected by the shutdown of clubs. Hotels, restaurants, gas stations, coffee shops, and countless other businesses will be negatively affected by fewer or no modellers traveling to your province. It would be a shame if these model airplane enthusiasts could no longer include Quebec in their list of destinations.

I would suggest you visit a radio control aircraft club and see for yourself what a wonderful hobby this is. You would be impressed by the fellowship and egalitarianism that abounds, crossing social and age differences. Doctors and Lawyers, engineers and office workers, labourers and trades people, seniors and youths, all on a first name basis, enjoying a common interest. A large proportion of RC modellers are retired people. The hobby encourages them to spend time outdoors, in a social environment, and to maintain their dexterity and hand-eye coordination – which brings benefits to them, their families, and society at large. This is the sort of atmosphere which strengthens a society and needs to be fostered. Please, give this issue the time and thought that it deserves.

Here is the contact information for those representing the affected parties.
M. Steve Woloz, MAAC Director for St-Lawrence Zone: 514-944-8241
M. Paul Burrage, MAAC Assistant Director for St-Lawrence Zone: 514-646-0536
M. Jean Chevalier, président for Club Modéliste Montérégie Napierville: 450-246-4543Thank you for your onsideration
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Old 12-16-2008, 10:14 PM   #2
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Re: Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ

Count on me!!!!!!!

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Old 12-17-2008, 03:45 AM   #3
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Re: Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ

I wish to apologize for the analogy I made in my post. I honestly did not intend to offend anyone. For me, and being disabled, RC is a very important part of my life, my therapy, if you would! I know how saddened it would make me if our fields here in Ontario were threatened, as yours are in Quebec. I felt hurt and angered that a situation like this could happen in any part of our beautiful Canada!

IF only these officials would pause long enough to educate themselves about and visit some of these clubs, they would see that RC'ers are a good group of folks from all age groups, all walks of life & ethnic backgrounds, who come together in peaceful surroundings to happily enjoy their passion for this hobby with one another. To the contrairy, we do not cause any damage to the land we use but actually improve the quality of the areas we use. I sincerely hope that this action against RC clubs in Quebec will come to an end and these good people can go on and enjoy this wonderful hobby!

If we all work together, we can make a difference! No matter how desperate this situation may become, we must all let calm hearts & rational thoughts prevail! All the best my friends!

You post the e-mail addresses and we'll swamp them with our concerns and protests! Lets do it!
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Old 12-17-2008, 09:11 AM   #4
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Re: Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ

It is lot a Lussier but a Huissier and yes it is a bailiff.

<I am in since I am a member of one of the targeted site.
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Old 12-17-2008, 09:25 AM   #5
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You publish the adresses and I'll start writing!
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Old 12-17-2008, 09:34 AM   #6
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Re: Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ

I have obviously missed something... what is the issue you are refering to?
(Did a search for posts from Bob, but still can't figure it out)
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Old 12-17-2008, 09:45 AM   #7
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Re: Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ

As you can see this is my original post no. 1, but I cut and pasted on this post, as I felt the one writen by Isabel, Scott and Dave was much better written and explained our situation much better. The one below was written under a very emotional time, right after Jean got that phone call. There is a lot of well written post on this thread, by reading many of them you will see and feel the frustrations that is going on in our area. Also thanks to RC Canada and Jason for having a link to our thread right on the home page.
Thank You RC Canada for doing this.
Bob



Well, just got off the phone with Jean Chevalier, and the CPTAQ sent a Lussier ( I think that is Baliff in english, but not sure. ) with a summons for a court date in Feb with the Superior Court. As you are all aware we are talking thousands of dollars. So the club will be stopping all activities at the field. So they wont be spending all that money, on a loosing cause.
But Jean's wife Dianne came out with a great suggestion. To send emails to all departments of government. and to Jean Charest. Every modeler in Canada has to send an email. By them getting thousands of emails, it might finally make it to get their attention. All we are asking is for a total of about 350 acres for the whole province. Right now they are working on getting all the email addresses and I will post them once I get them. So tell your friends about the story of what is going on. Wives, sons, daughters, cousins, everyone, that knows someone in the hobby has to get these emails out there. If they get floaded with thousands of emails, even the newspapers and tv and radio might get on the band wagon. these people like to publicize were there is alot of people involved in a cause.
Here we are the number one province in Canada in the Aeronauticale industry, and they want to stop the farm teams for future employees. As you are aware many RC flyers are in that industry. In our club we have members that work for Bell Helicoptor. Bombardier. Pratt and Whitney. Rolls Royce, and others. Bombardier is looking for employees, and can't get them locally, and have to go to Asia to get them. A young lad that is 15 years old and gets into the hobby, and loves it, and decides that he is going to do a career in that field, in 10 years from now will be 25 years old, and be able to work in that industry. 10 years in not a long time. That is what I mean, by a farm team. We plant that seed. This gvt wants to stop that seed from growing.
Even if USA flyers can send, this will be an embarrassment to the Quebec gvt. World Wide as fars as I am concerned. There will be more coming out on this, So far 5 clubs have been shut down. I am sure their will be more.
I hope I haven't bored you with my going on, but after talking to Jean, I was very upset and I had to let it out.
So get your keyboards ready to send those emails. I hope by tomorrow or thursday will have all the proper email adresses.
Thanks for listening.
. The CPTAQ is a gvt body that was formed in the early 70's by the Party Quebecqois, which is the separatist party. This group was formed because back then, farmers were busy, but also were selling their land and changing the zoning from farm land to commercial or residential. The CPTAQ put a stop to that. Now some 40 years later at least 40% of the land is not being used. As many of our products are coming from other parts of the world. So most flying clubs are on farming land. The CPTAQ says that farm land is only to be used by farmers to grow things. They don't care that all the clubs don't have permanent structures. The grass is cut, the land is well maintained. The farmer is happy as it also gives him security from vandals coming and starting fires, or dumping garbage. Our club is a perfect example of this, before we were renting from him, he had all kinds of problems with vandals. Now 18 years later, not one problem has arrisen.
So now the CPTAQ is taking these clubs to court. and all are losing their caes. This is a group of gvt employees who do not want to lose their jobs. Towns want to espand, and the CPTAQ is stoping them from re zoning the land. In our case no rezoning, all we want is a few acres to fly.
So basically this is what it is all about. If this continues, most RC clubs will disapear in the near future.
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Old 12-17-2008, 10:13 AM   #8
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Re: Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ

To All

There are a lot of persons not aware of this… And this is what is NOT helping us. I mean by that, that if everyone in all clubs of Quebec would have been aware of this, we would have been a lot more help, idea, support and contact to fight against this. From the last few years we keep us silent as we did not want to make to much noise, to not “hurt” the CPTAQ and maybe try to gain their “compassion”. But now, as all club is going to lost, we will need to inform as much persons as we can, maybe someone somewhere will have an idea or a contact in the government and will help us going through. I think if someone with great influence takes our cause under is wing it might help a lot.

We also need to remember that this is affecting or WILL affect mostly ALL club of Quebec. Eventually the CPTAQ will get over every field which are on “their” ground… So, even peoples which fly in peace now do have a good reason to fight with us and protect their future…

Thanks everyone, and please, do not give up…


Il y a beaucoup de personnes qui ne sont pas au courent de tout cela et cela ne nous aide pas du tout. Ce que je veux dire, c’est que si tout le monde dans tout les clubs du Québec et d’ailleurs étaient au courent de cela, nous aurions beaucoup plus d’idée, plus de contactes, plus d’impacte pour nous battre et gagner notre cause. Ces dernière années, nous avons gardé le silence afin de ne pas brusquer ou offensé la CPTAQ et ainsi peut-être obtenir leurs bonnes grâces. Mais maintenant, il semble que peu importe notre stratégie passive, nous allons perdre. Il est maintenant temps d’informer autant de monde que possible au Québec, au Canada et même ailleurs. Peut-être quelque part quelqu’un aura une idée ou aura dans ces connaissances une personne influente qui pourra nous aider grandement. Je pense que si quelqu’un d’important nous prenait sous son aile, cela pourrait nous aider grandement.

Il est important de rappeler que cette situation affection ou affectera presque TOUT les clubs au Québec. Éventuellement la CPTAQ va mettre la mains sur tous nos terrains. Donc même les gens qui fly en paix aujourd’hui devrait penser sérieusement à nous aider, car demain ce sera eux qui seront confrontés au problème… Je crois donc que tous et chacuns a une bonne raison de se battre.

Merci, à tous, et il ne faut pas abandonner…

Robin Leblond
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Club Modélisme Montérégie (Napierville).
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Old 12-17-2008, 11:04 AM   #9
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Re: Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ

I was thinking that a letter to Bombardier would be useful, so I wrote this and sent it off to their Media and Public Affairs department through their website. It took 3 tries, as the letter is long and they limit their message size, but hopefully it will be read by them. Can't hurt to try, anyway.

Letter begins:

To whom it may concern;

Please pass this message on to the Bombardier executive who would be able to act on this request. Thank you!

Flying model airplanes is a hobby and sport that is an important source of inspiration for people of all ages to learn about and get started in aviation. Certainly many of the people at Bombardier got their first opportunity to build and fly real flying machine through modelling, and that was the start of their careers in aviation and their lifelong wonder and joy at the beauty of manned flight.

The sport of flying model airplanes is under attack in Quebec. Model airplane clubs in Quebec are being forced to close because of government interference from CPTAQ. These clubs are being forced off farmland that is supposed to be used only for “growing things” and not for model airplanes. Many of these clubs have been flying off farmland for many years and only now are being pushed off for bureaucratic reasons. In many cases, farmland is the only good source of flying fields and clubs (which are not supported by the government!) cannot find or afford to purchase dedicated flying sites.

As the Canadian leader in aerospace, Bombardier certainly should be concerned about where the next generation of inspired and dedicated aerospace engineers, designers and technicians will come from. A strong and vibrant community of model aircraft clubs can help to inspire that next generation. However, if those clubs don't exist then maybe the next generation will be more interested in writing video games than contributing to the future of Bombardier and Canadian aerospace.

As a huge part of the economy of Quebec and a vital part of Canadian aerospace, perhaps it would be possible for the Bombardier executive to make the government of Quebec aware that the model airplane clubs are under attack and need the attention and care that the government can provide to restrain the bureaucracy and enable those clubs to thrive and pass on the love of aviation that we all share to the next generation.

Thank you very much for your time and consideration!

Sincerely yours,

John Sloan
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Old 12-17-2008, 11:42 AM   #10
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Re: Quebec Clubs need your help CPTAQ

Thanks John, excellent letter and to the point. Very good idea.
Thanks again,
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